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Scott Alexander's avatar

I might not be the person you're writing to as I have no strong opinion on when the cutoff time for abortion should be and 14 weeks seems fair, but I don't think this is a contradictory position.

Suppose we accept that a 14 week old fetus has about the same ability to suffer as a chicken.

Eating a factory farmed chicken causes a few months of suffering for the chicken, plus a violent death. Aborting a fetus causes a few minutes of suffering for the fetus, plus a violent death. Even if we say the fetus' suffering is 10x greater for the few minutes of the abortion procedure, the total for the chicken must be 1000x greater over time.

The benefits of eating chicken are a delicious meal. The benefits of aborting a fetus are avoiding months of pregnancy and (depending on whether the parents are able to adopt the baby out) years of unwanted child-raising. Let's say people care 1000x more about whether or not they have a child than whether or not they eat KFC, even when adoption is available.

So from a purely suffering-focused ethics. the costs are 1000x lower and the benefits are 1000x higher. I think under these circumstances it's very easy to support one but not the other. Also, there are 10,000x more chickens killed per year than fetuses, and it's an easier issue to make political progress on, so even if you did think abortion was net negative it's not clear it would ever cross your mind as an issue worth working on or writing about.

(the equivalent of the shrimp welfare charity for abortion would prevent 1,000 abortions per $1 with zero cost to anyone else including the mother - I think this is pretty different from what real pro-life activism involves!)

I think nobody including utilitarians actually uses the calculation above; problems with abortion from challenging the boundaries of what's human, or who owes whom what duty of care, or what it means about us if we kill family members, or bodily autonomy, or whatever, outweigh the suffering involved even for people with a strong tendency to focus on suffering-related ethics. I just don't think it's worth attacking on a basis of suffering-related ethics hypocrisy.

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Bentham's Bulldog's avatar

I do not have a view on when exactly animals become conscious, but I think abortion should be illegal after the point they are. So for both shrimp and people, I think they only should be unkillable after they are conscious.

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